[Date Prev][Date Next][Thread Prev][Thread Next][Date Index][Thread Index]

Re: (TFT) Goblin port



I think the problem of using foot races is that they do not represent what medieval warriors (even the heroic ones) could do, in that medieval warriors have armor, weapons, and no special training as athletes, and also because over the years the 'winning times' 'creep up' and become better...... so the best score today is not the same as the best score in the 1100s, let alone the normal score for a warrior.
On Aug 26, 2010, at 7:38 PM, Jay Carlisle wrote:

Goblin is a little vague on a couple of issues of scale.
The time length of a turn and the size of a hex are left undefined.
We can make some inferences from what they do tell us.

"Fighting Units: these represent about 25 goblin or human troopers in each unit."

"Leader Units: these represent an important troop leader with 3-5 men or goblins as escort."

"MP Allowances: all goblin leaders are unmounted and have 10 movement points (MPs). All feudal leaders can either act as mounted with 15 MP or unmounted infantry with 10 MP, as desired by the feudal player."

They also mention that stacking in a hex is limited to 3 Units without Leaders unless other options are not available.
The Duke and goblin King have a command rating of 12.
Also of note, all Units exert Zones of Control.
The actual map is 20 hexes n/s by 25 hexes e/w not counting the mountain column.

So, looking at the above, what do you think that says about the timescale of a turn and the size of a hex?

A command rating of 12 that supersedes other CR's in the hex suggest that 25 * 12 = about 305ish Figures in a hex.
There are 1300 something total goblins.
The humans have 1200 or so but 100+ are 'mounted'.
This means that 200 human footmen plus over 100 horses can fit into a hex. Horses average near five and a half feet in length from the point of the shoulder to the point of the rump which makes them sortta 2 hex Figures if you stand back real far and squint.
(Horses are an issue that I'll leave alone for now.)
This indicates a minimum of 400 Battle-map hexes for a Goblin hex, or 5 Battle-maps. This has the footmen standing more or less fingertips to fingertips apart. 1 mega-Battle-map (7 Battle-maps just like a mega-hex) ought to give 'em a touch more elbow room with 560 hexes total.
A mega-Battle-map is 3 Battle-maps across, or 30 hexes n/s.
30 hexes @ 1.3m per is about 128 feet or roughly a third of a football field.
This would make the County 3200 feet wide or about 60% of a mile.
Obviously a no go.
Okay, how about movement?
A rule of thumb for the Calvary (of the nineteenth century anyway) was "twenty miles a day on beans and hay". This would suggest that an infantry Unit ought to make fifteen miles in the same day by the MP's given.
This sounds reasonable.
Road movement for Calvary is 30 hexes in a turn.
This would suggest that each hex might be about a mile across.
20 by 25 miles is 500 square miles of area.
That sounds okay and sortta fits up there in North Yorkshire.
.
Uh ho.
I just thought of something.
The Tevis Cup covers 100 miles in a 24 hour period cross country.
About 50% of the animals are able to complete the race with an average winning time of about 10 hours and 45 minuets including mandatory 1 hour rests at the 30th and 70th miles.
The average moving rate is about 7.3 mph.
Then there's Huw.
In beating a field of runners and horses and riders in 2004 Huw Lobb completed the 22-mile course in two hours, five minutes, and 19 seconds.
We're back to foot races huh?
This is a problem with hero's in general isn't it?
Their BETTER than the rest of us aren't they?
32pt hero's seems SO much simpler. but players want that feeling of "development" and being better than the rest of us.
So what, crank up the Scale?
If each hex was 4 miles across then the map would be 100 miles e/w by 80 miles n/s with an area of 8000 square miles. The whole of North Yorkshire is only about 3300 square miles and that's the largest "county" in England I think. I will note that these are races and I doubt Huw was itching for a fight just after the race. However, because of how I build Units and allow them to be developed and improve I have to pay attention to issues involving a Unit of Tevis Cup trained Calvary. This is a VERY common problem when "translating" one game into another. I'd like to use Bendwyn as a example village but the thing suffers from major Scale issues of its own. The Broken Blade is something like 55,000 sq ft assuming it's just a single story. I know it's a "rather good inn" but 55,000 square feet is a good sized hospital or public school.
3000 square feet is an above average sized modern american house.
I can put something like 18 of them in the Blade's silhouette.
And I always thought the thing was multi-storied for some reason.
But that's a side point.
I'll just call a turn a day.
I'll call a Goblin-hex 4 miles across and 16 square miles in area fitting a square-hex.
This makes each square 1 square mile.
This lets me use section, township, range surveys to build hexes at this Scale across much of the u.s.

"The PLSS typically divides land into 6-miles to a side-square townships, which is the level of information included in the National Atlas. Townships are subdivided into 36 one-mile- square sections."

"Each township is identified with a township and range designation. Township designations indicate the location north or south of the baseline (e/w survey line), and range designations indicate the location east or west of the Principal Meridian (n/s survey line). For example, a township might be identified as Township 7 North, Range 2 West, which would mean that it was in the 7th tier of townships north of a baseline, and in the 2nd column of townships west of a baseline. A legal land description of a section includes the State, Principal Meridian name, Township and Range designations with directions, and the section number: Nebraska, Sixth Principal Meridian T7N, R2W, sec5."

Again not perfect as many BLM surveys were fraudulent but the idea works well and I can do this in Google Earth.
A township is 2.25 STR-hexes in area.
New Town ND has a population of about 1300 in an area of about 0.67 square miles. Wichita Falls, Texas has about 100,000 people in about 70 square miles (2 STR-hexes). I can fit the urban area of new York city (about 10 times larger than the city proper) on about half the Goblin map at this Scale and the full metro area takes about the whole map.

I'll adjust movement accordingly.
ZOC is out the window though.
As a matter of fact Units could quite possably pass each other in the same hex with each square being 41.25 Battle-maps across and a full STR-hex spaned by 165 Battle-maps. Of course, when the players choose how to build Units then there isn't a 25 Figure limit to Units either... =====
Post to the entire list by writing to tft@brainiac.com.
Unsubscribe by mailing to majordomo@brainiac.com with the message body
"unsubscribe tft"
=====
Post to the entire list by writing to tft@brainiac.com.
Unsubscribe by mailing to majordomo@brainiac.com with the message body
"unsubscribe tft"