Re: (TFT) Main gauche (two weapon) attacks and adjDX

[Christopher Fuhrman <fuhrman8or@yahoo.com>]

--- Rick Smith <rsmith@lightspeed.ca> wrote:

> Hi Cris,
> 	My feeling is it is better to accept the small
> unrealism than complicate the rules.  On the other 
> hand, attacking with 2 weapons is -6 DX on both attack
> now, isn't it?  In that case there is a special rule 
> either way, change it as you like.

Hi Rick,

There's a rule in Advanced Melee that says -6 for using two arbitrary
one-handed weapons (without the two-weapons talent). However, I
believe this to be different from the use of the main gauche. 

Also, there are other differences between Advanced and original Melee
in this regard. Usage of a main gauche as a shield in AdvMelee is
only -1 DX, where as it's -2 in original Melee.

Your -6 remark got me thinking. When the rules say -x as a shield and
-y if used as a weapon, do the two adjustments add, or does one
include the other. For example, the combination of -2 (shield benefit
of Main Gauche) and -4 for two-weapon attack would be a -6 DX
adjustment total. 

I quote the rules for "LEFT HAND DAGGER" from Melee (p. 11/12 of
original manual), so we can see how this can be interpreted in two
ways:

[rules]
THE LEFT-HAND DAGGER
  A fighter may use a main-gauche, or left-hand dagger, with any
other one-handed weapon. It may be used in two ways: (1) On any turn
the fighter uses it only as a shield, it stops one hit from any
non-missile attack, and adjusts his DX by -2. (2) On any turn he uses
it as a shield AND weapon, it still stops one hit from any
non-missile weapon. It also lets him make TWO attacks that turn
(against the same enemy); one with the main-gauche and one with the
other weapon. BOTH attacks are at DX -4. A main-gauche gets 1 - 1 in
HTH combat. A fighter may NOT use two daggers, or a main-gauche and
dagger, in HTH combat.
[/rules]

So, I originally understood this to be -2 and an additional -2.
Furthermore, when we read on, in the Shields section, just after the
Weapons Table:

[rules]
Main-gauche parries 1 hit/attack; -2 DX, or -4 if used as weapon.
[/rules]

Again this implies -2 as a shield, -4 as weapon. But what about
SHIELD and WEAPON. 

(BTW, there is another difference in the TFT Advanced Melee rules: a
fighter MAY use two daggers in HTH.)

Ok, so, using this rationale, I can agree that the -2 DX for shield
use goes to adjDX used for action orders (just as a large shield or
armor's adjustment would). 

Again I quote the rules, the section on DX adjustments (p.10):

[rules]
OTHER ADJUSTMENTS
Crossbowman lying prone +1
Pole weapon user standing still, against charging enemy +2
Missile/thrown attack against figure sheltering behind body -4

  Adjustments are figured before each attack. The adjDX represents
the chance to hit the enemy, as stated above. Attacks come off in
order of adjDX counting everything BUT missile and thrown weapon
range; a distant target makes you less accurate but no slower.
[/rules]

In fact, since main-gauche use is omitted from this section, it would
seem to imply that the dex penalties are always included in adjDX
ordering.

Standing behind a figure gives you +4 DX, which technically can allow
you to attack before someone else, right? I think the adjDX rules
tend to get very unrealistic in this regard. Does anyone play house
rules that clear this up?

For now, anway, I'm coding the whole -4 DX adjustment as ordering
penalty in the simulator. Since I'm just hacking/slashing, and not
dealing with missle/thrown weapons, there'll never be anything but
one type of adjDX. 

It's not a big deal to change it one day if needed (adjDX for
firing/throwing attacks). Eventually, I am hoping to turn the code
into a gaming tool, with movement, counters, etc. I already have many
reusable classes from my (unreleased) Ogre implementation in Java.

Cris


		
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