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Re: (TFT) unfinished Bendwyn (2nd try)
Okay I seem to have screwed this up last night, sorry all.
I'm trying to get Bendwyn to work like a little Sim City but as this talks
about I've run into issues of scale...
The following list of jobs is taken from; Medieval Demographics Made Easy
(Numbers for Fantasy Worlds) by S. Ross
Business / Population required per instance of business (called Support
Value or SV)
Chicken Butchers 1,000
Buckle Makers 1,400
Spice Merchants 1,400
Hay Merchants 2,300
*These are licensed doctors. Total doctor SV is 350.
Some other figures: There will be one noble household per 200 population,
one lawyer ("advocate") per 650, one clergyman per 40 and one priest per
Businesses not listed here will most likely have an SV from 5,000 to 25,000!
The "Magic Shop" means a shop where wizards can purchase spell ingredients,
scroll paper and the like, not a place to buy magic swords off the shelf.
The SV list was taken (mostly) from the tax list of Paris in 1292, and
checked against other sources for accuracy. This list can be found in Life
in a Medieval City by Joseph and Francis Geis (Harper and Row, 1981). This
is a fine book by amateur historians, which includes some fascinating
descriptions of medieval city life and layout.
For reference this is the Table of Jobs from ATFT ITL
Job / Requirements /Pay / Risk
Unskilled/farmhand/etc. none, none, none
Fisherman/Sailor Seamanship, $30, 4/17
Forester/Hunter / Trapper, Naturalist - Tracking, $30, 3/18
Town Laborer, none, $5, none
Shop Worker, etc., Literacy, $10, none
Armourer/Smith, Armourer OR Goldsmith, $100, 3/18
Master Armourer, Master Armourer, $150, 3/18
Merchant (any type), Business Sense - Assess Value, $75, 3/18
Healer, Master Physicker, $100, 4/18
Scholar/Teacher/Scribe, Scholar, $75, 4/18
Sage, Scholar - 3 Languages, $125, 4/18
Priest, Priest - Charisma, $75, 3/18
High Priest, Priest - Charisma - Theologian - Business Sense - Detection of
Lies, $150, 3/18
Chemist, Chemist, $100 (or profits from sale if owner) 3/16
Builder, Architect - Builder OR Shipbuilder, $50, 3/18
Animal/Bird Trainer, Animal Handler - Monster Followers - Vet, $75, 4/17
Minstrel, Bard, IQ * 4, 3/18
Entertainer, Bard & one of: Charisma - Sex Appeal - Acrobatics - Mimic -
Ventriloquist, 15 * # of listed Talents, 3/18
Translator, 3 Languages - Literacy, # of Languages * 15, 3/18
Mathematician, Mathematician, IQ * 6, 3/18
Calligrapher, Artist &/OR (?) Calligrapher, $50, 3/18
Petty Thief, Thief, $100, 5/15
Burglar, Silent Movement - Thief, $150, 5/14
Professional Thief, Master Thief - Remove Traps, $150, 4/15
Highwayman/Brigand, 3 Weapon Talents "skills", $250, 5/12
Mercenary Recruit, 3 Weapon Talents, $50, 5/16
Merc Vet, 4 Weapon Talents - UCI, $75, 4/17
Merc Cptn., 5 Weapon Talents - UCI - Tactics, $125, 4/17
Army/Police Recruit, 3 Weapon Talents, $50, 5/16
Army/Police Regular, 4 Weapon Talents, UCI, $75, 4/17
Army/Police Sergeant, 5 Weapons Talents, UCI, Tactics, $125, 4/17
Army/Police Officer, 5 Weapon Talents - UCI - Tactics - Strategist -
Engineer - Diplomacy OR 5 years as a sergeant, $250, 3/17
Army/Police Auxiliary, Driver OR Engineer OR Tracker OR Priest, $50, 3/17
Courier, Alertness - Running - Swimming - Expert Horsemanship - 2 Weapons
Talents, $80, 4/17
Spy, Spying - Silent Movement - Disguise - Literacy - 3 Languages - Master
Thief, $250, 5/15
Tax Collector, Literacy - Detection of Lies, $75, 4/15
Fighting-ship Crewman, Seamanship, Boating, Swimming, 2 Weapon Talents, $50,
Rogue, Sex Appeal - Bard - Alertness - Charisma - Bussiness Sense, IQ * 7,
Armsmaster, DX 15; 6 Weapon Skills +, 10 * # of Weapon and UC Talents, 4/17
Wizards Jobs (A requirement for all of these, naturally, is that you must be
Apprentice, Aid Spell, $25, 4/18
Journeyman, IQ 10; Aid Spell, 3 * IQ, 4/18
Town Wizard, IQ 11-13, $75, 4/17
IQ 14-16, $120, 4/17
IQ 17-18, $200, 4/17
Town Wizard Extraordinaire, IQ 19 +, $300, 4/16
Mercenary Recruit, DX 12; ST 12; 6 combat spells, $75, 5/15
Mercenary Veteran, DX 13; ST 15; 7 combat spells, $125, 4/16
Mercenary Captain, DX 14; ST 16; 8 combat spells - Diplomacy - Business
Sense, $250, 3/17
Army/Police Recruit, 5 combat spells, $50, 5/16
Army/Police Regular, 7 combat spells, $75, 4/17
Army/Police Sergeant, 8 combat spells - Tactics, $125, 4/17
Army/Police Officer, 8 combat spells - Tactics - Strategist - Diplomacy OR
5 years as a sergeant, $250, 3/17
Wizardly Thief, Silent Movement - Lock/Knock spell, $150, 5/14
Wizardly Brigand. 6 combat spells, $250, 5/12
Entertainer, Sex Appeal AND/OR Charisma - several showy spells, 8 * # of
showy spells (+ $20 Bard, + $40 Master Bard), 3/18
These are other notes
The basic Job List for a region will always be concerned with Primary
Production of necessities; Food, Shelter and Clothing.
In pre-industrial societies the vast majority of the population will have
occupations directly involved in the production of necessities, often being
grouped into social classes like slave or serf.
The Primary Production materials chosen to meet the necessities will define
much about the culture being created.
Food is judged by how well the available sources maintain the Half-Life of
Calories are the main unit of concern with each member of the population
requiring daily a number of calories equal to the labor preformed for their
Job. For example, virgin growth, hand tool loggers in the Pacific Northwest
in the early 1900's could consume over 8000 calories per day without weight
Other nutrient deficiencies, scurvy for example, occur over longer
timescales than starvation.
Cultivation (limited agriculture where a food source receives a limited
amount of labor to establish, maintain or increase the source)
Indigenous Soil Management (Terra preta)
On a mainly wheat diet 2.5 lbs. of whole wheat flour provides about 3500
calories per day, enough to support an active lifestyle for 1 Figure for 1
Shelter is judged by materials used and methods of construction.
At minimum, shelter provides protection from prolonged exposure to the
Other functions, like military protection, can also be added as required.
Of note here, a cultures 'alignment' has a strong effect on the structure of
A society with Laws establishing privacy rights also generates buildings
with more rooms for example.
(The more nomadic the culture the more shelter is related to clothing)
Clothing is also protection from exposure, but is designed more for the
particular Job or function of the individual wearing it.
By now it's obvious that the source of a society's clothing will have
implications on the labor needed to produce the requirements.
Linen, cotton, hides, wool, silk and others are primary production concerns.
Secondary production of clothing leads to another discussion.
This is where Mr. Ross' list comes in.
A village of fifteen hundred people can barely muster a single blacksmith
but would have ten cobblers?
TFT doesn't even have a tailor listed on the Jobs Table, but Mundane Talents
does list draper, tanner and leather worker.
Assuming access to leather, a simple moccasin consists of 3 pieces, the
sole, the vamp that covers the top of the foot, and the back piece.
These are cut to fit the foot being made for, stitched together and secured
with a leather thong.
I would call this low quality footwear, and give penalties for a number of
footing situations. (Silent Movement gets a bonus)
I include low quality food, shelter and clothing together in subsistence
Talent I call Yeoman, Homesteading, Peasantry or similar depending on the
time-period and technologies involved.
Figures possessing such a Talent and given access to required resources can
be expected to maintain their properties with little outside support and
even produce small surpluses under favorable conditions.
Joined shoes require a specialized toolset and leads to cordwainers.
This is generally true of any profession; even the peon class catch-all
Talents require a set of basic hand tools to maintain the property, create
produce and accomplish the myriad of other tasks required in operating a
A production chain might look something like so;
Primary Source: Hides
Generating Talent: Woodsman (closest IMO to "Hunting" from TFT Talent
List) - Sheppard - Herdsman - Cowboy/Vaquero; etc.
Assisting Talents: Naturalist - Expert Naturalist - Vet (anatomy) - Monster
Followers. - Mimic - Tracking - Silent Movement - Acute Hearing -
Alertness - Missile OR Thrown Weapon (Guns) - Running; probably others.
(Required equipment depends upon the prey and method employed in
Production Talents: Tanner
Required equipment and additional Primary Resources depends upon method
employed in producing the Leather.
An example is about 5lbs Salt in solution with 2lbs Alum and about 10 gal.
soft-water (i.e. rainwater) for a 10 to 12 sq ft (finished) deer hide over
about a week, with Salt and Alum having their own procurement methods in the
This product can now be further "worked" with different distinct production
steps possibly equating to Jobs.
(If you have a beekeeper or two you can boil leather in the beeswax.)
Historically crop yields from ancient times through the sixteenth century
ran about 4:1, with yields of 3:1 being about the minimum average for
reliable subsistence farming.
The rule of thumb at these production levels is 1 townsperson supported per
Although periods of bumper crops did occur, both yields and quality lowered
significantly after the collapse of Rome's empire into anarchy only
surpassing Pax Romana averages with reliable yields @ 5:1 around the start
of the seventeenth century.
Near Brussels in the fifteenth century a yield ratio of 14:1 (three and a
half times the 4:1 average) was obtained for almost 50 years in a row (2.5
That allows a townsperson to eat for every three farmers.
Modern crop yields have improved by an order of magnitude with farmers
expecting average wheat yields of about forty bushels per bushel planted.
Climate has a strong effect on agriculture.
Areas with a single growing season use a more labor intensive two-field
management system, planting a field every other year using ~50% of the
arable land for crop each year.
More temperate climates have 2 growing seasons each year and can take
advantage of a three-field system of soil management, planting a summer crop
in one field, a winter crop in another and allowing the third to lie fallow,
thus working about 66% of the arable land per year.
Also of note, fallow land is usually plowed twice; helping to keep weeds
down and "green manuring" the field. (Beans fix nitrogen outta the air so
growing them and plowing them under adds nitrogen into the soil.)
This means that 150% of the land in a 2-field system goes under the plow
each year vs. 133% in a three field system.
Climate can be broadly defined according to location.
Location also has much to say about the arable acres available for
cultivation and the geometry used to shape fields.
Some of the best farmland is the rich alluvial bottomlands by rivers, but
their frequent floods do too much damage to unfurrowed tilling to risk
cultivation without heavy plows.
Get out of the arid, thin-soiled, Mediterranean climate into the more
temperate European regions and the Roman "scratch-plow" had to "cross plow
(plow twice)" the deeper northern top-soil to get effective aeration w/o
fast soil exhaustion.
Matching the crop to good "fields" suited to them is also a matter of
Some crops like oats (oats and horses are intimately connected) fair best
on flat fields while many wheat's do well on gently sloped fields.
Then there is technology.
Simply moving a culture from hoes and spades to plows pulled by animals (any
animal) improves speed of work and also frees up from a third to a half of
the societies tool-iron resources for other uses.
The quicker a workforce can accomplish maintenance of its support
infrastructure the more time it has for other tasks like increasing that
infrastructure, for farmers that would be clearing more land for crops for
instance, or double-digging fallow fields.
In a campaign with a zero-point culmination beyond the period at which a
technological innovation is likely to be commonly propagated the culture
will actually be transforming itself during gameplay.
Take the example of a culture moving from oxen to horses around the year
1000 in medieval times.
The use of a horse in the fields had several disadvantages before this time.
Horses require significantly more fodder than oxen and horses require
significantly more maintenance than oxen, having trouble over swaths of
terrain (rocky for example) that oxen tolerate better.
Also, the use of yolk-harnessing for oxen did not make a very efficient use
of the horses' power.
A yolk around the horses' neck only allowed the animal to pull with about
1000 foot pounds of effective work which equated the work possible with an
The horseshoe (circa 900) increased the horses durability and the
horse-collar allowed the animal to apply force from the chest with a
five-fold increase in work.
When all is said and done a shoed and collared horse works around 50% faster
than an ox at a price of more fodder per animal, (and iron for shoes, tack
This effectively means that a peasant can travel 50% further from his home
with a shoed and collared horse and still get the same work done as a
peasant with an ox.
Some of the fields that went for human food go to oats however.
In this case the tech makes the town bigger.
Next there are simply issues of society.
Animal teams require a large investment of both capital and time, but their
use improved production to the point that access to a plow could be
encouraged or even required by the landholding nobleman.
In many feudal set-ups a given team was jointly owned/used by several
This led to arguments about who had access to the team on a given day (big
These arguments were litigated out locally and had strong effects on the
shape and use of the communities fields.
One commonly used solution during the period was to plow very long narrow
fields and to give everyone scattered lengths of the plows across the whole
holdings fields. (This also takes advantage of the fact that most crops grow
better on the edges of a field than in the center)
This gave everyone cultivatable sections each year with the most productive
sections coming under the control of the best farmers more gradually, thus
keeping down unrest in the community.
Religious prejudice introduces the silly element to the thing.
Religion has about as much a place in some occupations as liquor does.
It doesn't really hurt agricultural production when the disembodied voices
from "heaven" tell you to snip things off your babies, but when they start
dictating planting and work times.
Then there is the root economics which is what this is all talking about.
Economics is a game that works on multiple levels in the same fashion as
A "win" on one level doesn't equate to a "win" overall; although I'm sure it
The Pax Romana's ultimate collapse into anarchy meant that what capital
(real wealth? Make people do what you want with 'treasure'?) was still
available was used defensively rather than progressively in a manner that
supported development of technologies that build and expand rather than
attack and protect form others attacks.
In other words, borrowing "money" to improve your holding comes at a
prohibitive interest rate under medieval anarchy assuming there is any money
available to invest at all.
"One has to be very careful when generalizing about what techniques were
used where. This is because we have little evidence to go on, especially
concerning the peasants, whose lives were of little concern to the monks
writing religious histories. Also, the poor communications between manors
meant that widely different techniques and tools might be used in a fairly
local area. However, it does seem likely that the light scratch plow, oxen,
yoke harness, and two-field system were in general use in Western Europe in
the Early Middle Ages."
Currency Pounds (#), shillings (s) and pence (d). There are 12d in a
shilling and 20s in a pound.
Coins At first, the only coin is the silver penny. In 1279, the groat (4d)
and the farthing (1/4d) are added. In 1344, the gold florin (6s) is
introduced but is soon replaced by the noble (6s 8d). In 1465, the rose
noble or ryal (10s) is introduced and the angel (6s 8d) replaces the noble.
What money buys
. According to the Domesday Book, a survey of property in England in 1086,
40 acres of land in Wallington is worth 50s.
. In the mid-1300s, farm workers and thatchers are paid 1d a day.
. Henry V's minstrels are paid 12d a day, the same as surgeons and archers.
. The poll tax of 1377, which led to the Peasants' Revolt, was levied at an
average rate of 4d per person aged over 14.
. The cost of the pageant on the anniversary of the death of John of Gaunt's
wife Blanche in 1374 is #45, including an elaborate Mass and dinner at the
Savoy, his London home.
. In the 1200s, tournament champion William Marshal is offered #500 a year
by the duke of Burgundy for his services as a knight.
. During a tournament at Dunstable in 1343, Edward III's expenditure is #317
. The cost of building Harlech Castle in Gwynedd between 1285 and 1290 is
. The first phase of Westminster Abbey, built during Henry III's reign,
. The amount of coin in circulation in the 1290s is about #1,000,000.
1 August 1086
Domesday Book published
William I is presented with the Domesday Book, the first census of England,
at Old Sarum (near present-day Salisbury), where the greatest landowners
also swear allegiance to him. The census is complete after officials have
been sent to every county in England - except the four northern shires,
which are under threat from the Scots - to record who owns what and where,
so the king can raise money for defence purposes. Orderic Vitalis, a
chronicler, says: 'There was not even an ox or a cow or a pig left that was
not set down in writing.' The total value of the holdings is #73,000. The
name 'Domesday Book' is given to the manuscript a century later because,
like the Day of Judgement, it cannot be avoided.
1 Inn, The Broken Blade "a rather good Inn." - Inns 2,000
2 Taverns, The Gloden Ax, Skarg's - Taverns/Restaurants 400 * 2 = 800
1 Magic Shop, The local magic shop - Magic-Shops 2,800
There is also a "Scribe" location which is a very large building on the map,
although there is some question as to if the building is shared with the
Even so, the Scribe likely has as much floor-space as the General Store,
thus making the assumption that at least some bookbinding is happening on
the location likely.
Mr. Ross's list suggests Bendwyn has a population of at least roughly 3000
As this list is largely drawn from tax records, the question of who bears
the tax burden can multiply that figure of 3000SV by as much as 4 or more
Assuming only ~25% of the population are working males Bendwyn's population
is around 12,000.
This is on the large side for a village by population.
Hummm, I wonder what the Bendwyn map tells me.
1 hex is 20m sts.
20 meters = 65.6167979 feet.
The map shows an area 35 by 51 hexes or 700 by 1020m or roughly 2,296.58793
feet by 3,346.45669 feet.
Philadelphia was the first city in America planned as a grid (or planned at
all), the original Wm. Penn plan for Philadelphia in the 1680's was to have
8 properties per block, per side, the "Greene Country Towne", which was what
determined the planned size of the block. This was to be surrounded by
80-acre "gentlenman's estates".
An old Philadelphia city block is approximately 400-425 feet per side, which
means an entire city block is roughly 3.5 to 4 acres, and there are about 13
blocks in a mile.
An approximation of this block-scale on the Bendwyn map is 6 by 7, 20m
hexes, or 42 hexes, or 6 mega-hexes per city block, giving 42.5 city blocks
across the full area.
With 16 total lots per block and about 10 hexes for roads, alleys and other
public access each lot is about 2 hexes or 800 square meters equaling
8,611.12833 square feet; a reasonable residential lot size by modern u.s.
Setting each acre at 14 hexes, or 2 mega-hexes is 3 acres per block, or
127.5 acres per Bendwyn scale map, with a city blocks land costing 3 to 5s
This is half of old Paris in 1575 in area, one more page would cover the
whole of the walled portion of the city.
Paris held a population of two to three hundred thousand at the time.
The farmers market covers roughly the area of the Jardin du Luxembourg,
Skarg's is the size of the Bastille and the Broken Blade is about the size
of the Louvre.
The 1636 mud count (recensement des boues) gives 415,000 people living in
20,400 homes (20.6 people per house).
As this is a de jure population an additional 6% or so can be added to cover
students, visitors and other temporary residents giving a total population
of around 440,000 souls, around 110,000 of which are working aged males.
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