TFT Digest Tuesday, April 29 2008 Volume 03 : Number
1006
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Date: Mon, 28 Apr 2008 20:51:07 -0400
From: Ray Rangel <ray.rangel@cox.net>
Subject: RE: (TFT) Is TFT a role playing or board game?
I think you're right about this, Rick.
To address the 'topic' directly:
TFT, taken as a whole, is an RPG. Melee and Wizards are board games in
their own right.
- ---- Rick Smith <rsmith@lightspeed.ca> wrote:
I do not think that if a game system can have
programmed adventures written for it or not
has much to say on if such a game system is a
role playing system or a board game.
Barbarian King is a solitaire board game.
Alone Against The Wendigo is for the role
playing game, Call of Cthulhu.
Now a RPG that is tightly written would be
easier to build programmed adventures for, but
beyond that, I don't see much connection.
Rick
On Mon, 2008-28-04 at 11:48 -0400, George Dew wrote:
Just a quick statement about programmed adventures (PA). (BTW, Chris'
adventure, "Wolves on the Rhine," published by Dark City Games is
excellent).
Chris is right that PAs are limiting.
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Diplomacy is the art of saying, "Nice doggy..." while reaching for a
rock.
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Date: Mon, 28 Apr 2008 21:07:05 -0400
From: "Wizard Master" <wizardmaster@gmail.com>
Subject: (TFT) Leaving List
I have been lurking for quite awhile ... some time actually. I havent
ever
posted but I have been enjoying the very useful threads and posts but
enough
is enough. I am tired of one person attacking other people in their
posts. I
am removing myself from this list. A new person posted his thoughts and
ideas and he is personally attacked by someone on this list. Another
person
brings up some good points and this person attacked him for a falsely
visioned insult. Now in his reply to someone else on a completly
different
topic saw fit to include an attack on that other person. I love this
game
having played this 20+ years ago but one person is ruining it by
personally
insulting other people and is very rude and obnoxious. Its a shame
that one
person can not handle just be polite.
Just thought the moderator of this list should know the reason for my
depature.
- -Dave
=====
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------------------------------
Date: Mon, 28 Apr 2008 20:36:17 -0500
From: David Jackson <azog@bellsouth.net>
Subject: Re: (TFT) Is TFT a role playing or board game?
Oh you're a butthead. And you NEVER CALLED ME BACK, you hoser!
:)
David
On Apr 28, 2008, at 3:13 PM, Jay Carlisle wrote:
Speaking for myself, this list is the ONLY outlet I have for this
stuff and I am deeply intrested in what ANYONY has to say.
All opinions are respected and this "end" of the network.
I'll always agree to disagree at the very worst.
Thanks for the insightful post Mr. Brandon
--
_______________________________________________
Get your free email from http://www.boardermail.com
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------------------------------
Date: Mon, 28 Apr 2008 20:37:34 -0500
From: David Jackson <azog@bellsouth.net>
Subject: Re: (TFT) Is TFT a role playing or board game?
Why are we afraid to call Wizard and Melee wargames?
Because they are...wargames.
David
On Apr 28, 2008, at 7:51 PM, Ray Rangel wrote:
I think you're right about this, Rick.
To address the 'topic' directly:
TFT, taken as a whole, is an RPG. Melee and Wizards are board games
in their own right.
---- Rick Smith <rsmith@lightspeed.ca> wrote:
I do not think that if a game system can have
programmed adventures written for it or not
has much to say on if such a game system is a
role playing system or a board game.
Barbarian King is a solitaire board game.
Alone Against The Wendigo is for the role
playing game, Call of Cthulhu.
Now a RPG that is tightly written would be
easier to build programmed adventures for, but
beyond that, I don't see much connection.
Rick
On Mon, 2008-28-04 at 11:48 -0400, George Dew wrote:
Just a quick statement about programmed adventures (PA). (BTW,
Chris'
adventure, "Wolves on the Rhine," published by Dark City Games is
excellent).
Chris is right that PAs are limiting.
=====
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body
"unsubscribe tft"
--
Diplomacy is the art of saying, "Nice doggy..." while reaching for
a rock.
=====
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------------------------------
Date: Mon, 28 Apr 2008 21:39:53 -0400
From: "Jonathan & Laura" <jlekevans@sbcglobal.net>
Subject: RE: (TFT) Leaving List
I have to agree with Dave, here. Over the last few days I've been
seriously
contemplating leaving because of the actions of this poster. If there
is
going to be no moderation of uncivil behavior/personal attacks, I'm
going to
sign-off also.
And a public thanks to Ray Rangel for not rising to plenty of "bait".
Jonathan
- -----Original Message-----
From: tft-admin@brainiac.com [mailto:tft-admin@brainiac.com] On Behalf
Of
Wizard Master
Sent: Monday, April 28, 2008 9:07 PM
To: tft@brainiac.com
Subject: (TFT) Leaving List
I have been lurking for quite awhile ... some time actually. I havent
ever
posted but I have been enjoying the very useful threads and posts but
enough
is enough. I am tired of one person attacking other people in their
posts. I
am removing myself from this list. A new person posted his thoughts and
ideas and he is personally attacked by someone on this list. Another
person
brings up some good points and this person attacked him for a falsely
visioned insult. Now in his reply to someone else on a completly
different
topic saw fit to include an attack on that other person. I love this
game
having played this 20+ years ago but one person is ruining it by
personally
insulting other people and is very rude and obnoxious. Its a shame
that one
person can not handle just be polite.
Just thought the moderator of this list should know the reason for my
depature.
- -Dave
=====
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------------------------------
Date: Mon, 28 Apr 2008 20:46:58 -0500
From: David Jackson <azog@bellsouth.net>
Subject: Re: (TFT) Leaving List
That's a shame, Dave, that you feel that way. But, a discussion
where everyone agrees with everyone else is, and no-one ever
disagrees is a boring one indeed.
As for the personal insults, since the only I've seen doing this
lately has been Ray, then maybe you should address your comments to
him personally.
David
On Apr 28, 2008, at 8:07 PM, Wizard Master wrote:
I have been lurking for quite awhile ... some time actually. I
havent ever posted but I have been enjoying the very useful threads
and posts but enough is enough. I am tired of one person attacking
other people in their posts. I am removing myself from this list. A
new person posted his thoughts and ideas and he is personally
attacked by someone on this list. Another person brings up some
good points and this person attacked him for a falsely visioned
insult. Now in his reply to someone else on a completly different
topic saw fit to include an attack on that other person. I love
this game having played this 20+ years ago but one person is
ruining it by personally insulting other people and is very rude
and obnoxious. Its a shame that one person can not handle just be
polite.
Just thought the moderator of this list should know the reason for
my depature.
-Dave =====
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------------------------------
Date: Mon, 28 Apr 2008 20:55:15 -0500
From: David Jackson <azog@bellsouth.net>
Subject: Re: (TFT) Leaving List
I have not made a single personal attack on anyone.
However, Ray Rangel had become personally insulting to me.
I am not going to take the fall here simply because I disagreed with
a new poster.
David
On Apr 28, 2008, at 8:39 PM, Jonathan & Laura wrote:
I have to agree with Dave, here. Over the last few days I've been
seriously
contemplating leaving because of the actions of this poster. If
there is
going to be no moderation of uncivil behavior/personal attacks, I'm
going to
sign-off also.
And a public thanks to Ray Rangel for not rising to plenty of "bait".
Jonathan
-----Original Message-----
From: tft-admin@brainiac.com [mailto:tft-admin@brainiac.com] On
Behalf Of
Wizard Master
Sent: Monday, April 28, 2008 9:07 PM
To: tft@brainiac.com
Subject: (TFT) Leaving List
I have been lurking for quite awhile ... some time actually. I
havent ever
posted but I have been enjoying the very useful threads and posts
but enough
is enough. I am tired of one person attacking other people in their
posts. I
am removing myself from this list. A new person posted his thoughts
and
ideas and he is personally attacked by someone on this list.
Another person
brings up some good points and this person attacked him for a falsely
visioned insult. Now in his reply to someone else on a completly
different
topic saw fit to include an attack on that other person. I love
this game
having played this 20+ years ago but one person is ruining it by
personally
insulting other people and is very rude and obnoxious. Its a shame
that one
person can not handle just be polite.
Just thought the moderator of this list should know the reason for my
depature.
-Dave
=====
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------------------------------
Date: Mon, 28 Apr 2008 19:15:53 -0700 (PDT)
From: pvk@oz.net
Subject: RE: (TFT) Leaving List
There have certainly been some upset misunderstandings and outbursts,
and
no one moderating them. I've seen plenty such disagreements about game
ideas since fourth grade or earlier, so I'm not terribly surprised or
upset by them, but I will miss people who decide to leave the list
because
of them (even though such a protest itself seems to me to be making the
misunderstandings more meaningful than they deserve).
=====
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------------------------------
Date: Mon, 28 Apr 2008 21:01:53 -0500
From: David Jackson <azog@bellsouth.net>
Subject: Re: (TFT) Leaving List
I take that back - I had not made any personal attacks until Ray had
made his. I think I called him emotionally disturbed.
David
On Apr 28, 2008, at 8:55 PM, David Jackson wrote:
I have not made a single personal attack on anyone.
However, Ray Rangel had become personally insulting to me.
I am not going to take the fall here simply because I disagreed
with a new poster.
David
On Apr 28, 2008, at 8:39 PM, Jonathan & Laura wrote:
I have to agree with Dave, here. Over the last few days I've been
seriously
contemplating leaving because of the actions of this poster. If
there is
going to be no moderation of uncivil behavior/personal attacks,
I'm going to
sign-off also.
And a public thanks to Ray Rangel for not rising to plenty of "bait".
Jonathan
-----Original Message-----
From: tft-admin@brainiac.com [mailto:tft-admin@brainiac.com] On
Behalf Of
Wizard Master
Sent: Monday, April 28, 2008 9:07 PM
To: tft@brainiac.com
Subject: (TFT) Leaving List
I have been lurking for quite awhile ... some time actually. I
havent ever
posted but I have been enjoying the very useful threads and posts
but enough
is enough. I am tired of one person attacking other people in
their posts. I
am removing myself from this list. A new person posted his
thoughts and
ideas and he is personally attacked by someone on this list.
Another person
brings up some good points and this person attacked him for a falsely
visioned insult. Now in his reply to someone else on a completly
different
topic saw fit to include an attack on that other person. I love
this game
having played this 20+ years ago but one person is ruining it by
personally
insulting other people and is very rude and obnoxious. Its a shame
that one
person can not handle just be polite.
Just thought the moderator of this list should know the reason for my
depature.
-Dave
=====
Post to the entire list by writing to tft@brainiac.com.
Unsubscribe by mailing to majordomo@brainiac.com with the message
body
"unsubscribe tft"
=====
Post to the entire list by writing to tft@brainiac.com.
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body
"unsubscribe tft"
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------------------------------
Date: Tue, 29 Apr 2008 08:31:34 -0400
From: Joe Hartley <jh@brainiac.com>
Subject: Re: (TFT) Leaving List
On Mon, 28 Apr 2008 21:39:53 -0400
"Jonathan & Laura" wrote:
If there is
going to be no moderation of uncivil behavior/personal attacks, I'm
going to
sign-off also.
"Wizard Master" wrote:
Just thought the moderator of this list should know the reason for my
depature.
Those of you who have been on this list a long time will know that my
approach to moderating is... laid-back. My theory is that groups tend
to
be self-moderating, and when someone is acting like a tool, an apology
tends to come out soon or the tool leaves in a huff when people call
him
on it. (I'd say him or her, but oddly, there are no women to my
knowledge
on this list.)
I have not read all the emails that have come through the list lately,
as
I'm moving a server room to two different locations and relocating an
office
of about 50 people in the middle of all this, and I'd seen a couple of
poorly-written words, and offense taken where there was possibly none
intended. I have not seen it become uglier, so I must have missed
something.
I will write to people off list as necessary, but a few notes to all
list members: Be civil, and remember that things written
sarcastically,
cynically or tongue-in-cheek can often be taken the wrong way.
- --
======================================================================
Joe Hartley - UNIX/network Consultant - jh@brainiac.com
Without deviation from the norm, "progress" is not possible. - FZappa
=====
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------------------------------
Date: Tue, 29 Apr 2008 09:16:40 -0500
From: Mark Tapley <mtapley@swri.edu>
Subject: (TFT) Re: TFT Digest V3 #1005
At 20:46 -0400 4/28/08, TFT Digest wrote:
An explosion expands in a sphere so I would expect
it to decrease ~1/r^3.
The volume of a sphere does indeed go as 1/r^3, but the surface area,
along which the shock wave acts, goes as 1/r^2. I had thought the
latter was a better approximation, but I'm not sure about that. If
PvK is doing actual research, he'll be much better qualified to
answer than me.
- --
- Mark, 210-379-4635
-
-----------------------------------------------------------------------
Large Asteroids headed toward planets
inhabited by beings that don't have
technology adequate to stop them:
Think of it as Evolution in Fast-Forward.
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------------------------------
Date: Tue, 29 Apr 2008 07:30:24 -0700
From: "Christopher Brandon" <brandon@pokemon-seattle.com>
Subject: RE: (TFT) Leaving List
Hello-
As a new poster I was quite off put by the first reaction to my
thoughts
on the game system. Clearly my heretical thoughts offended Mr. Jackson
or at least the manner in which I stated them apparently did. For that
I did apologize. I did not appreciate the antagonistic and rude manner
in which he voiced his discontent, but clearly the manner in which I
made my post offended him. As a result of his less than polite
disagreement I had decided to simply stay quiet.
Then other responses turned up. I think the vast majority of folks
read
it for what I meant it to be: an inquiry into an alternate way of
creating adventures that mirrored similar video games-and whether or
not
that idea is interesting to current TFT'ers on the list. The vast
majority took time to discuss it, think about it, and share there own
insights, disagreements, and comments in a friendly and thoughtful
manner.
To my way of reading it Mr. Jackson has a tendency to take offense at
thoughts counter to his own and then in a very aggressive and
disparaging way respond. I do take offense to many of his statements,
but rather than respond in kind, I just let it go. It does not serve
me
or, the community to respond in kind to many statements that I
personally read as rude or unkind.
I made the mistake of deciding to let Mr. Jackson bully me off the
boards. I see there are others who now may be thinking the same thing.
I would ask those thinking of this to please stay on as I did.
The majority of folks I have encountered on the board are thoughtful,
innovative, and passionate about this game. Should one fellow be given
the power to drive us off? I think not. Removing someone I think is
the easy way out.
Mr. Jackson probably has some really interesting and great things to
say, unfortunately the language he chooses to use is very unpleasant
and
his message is lost to me because of it. I quit reading his posts
altogether for now and my problem was solved. If there is a someone (me
for instance) whose posts or language you dislike, then just ignore the
post. You do not have to read everything, and you should not let one
negative wipe out a lot of positive enjoyment you get from sharing
thoughts and innovations on these lists. Don't punish yourself for
someone else's bad behavior.
Cheers!
Chris
- -----Original Message-----
From: tft-admin@brainiac.com [mailto:tft-admin@brainiac.com] On Behalf
Of Joe Hartley
Sent: Tuesday, April 29, 2008 5:32 AM
To: tft@zappa.brainiac.com
Subject: Re: (TFT) Leaving List
On Mon, 28 Apr 2008 21:39:53 -0400
"Jonathan & Laura" wrote:
If there is
going to be no moderation of uncivil behavior/personal attacks, I'm
going to
sign-off also.
"Wizard Master" wrote:
Just thought the moderator of this list should know the reason for my
depature.
Those of you who have been on this list a long time will know that my
approach to moderating is... laid-back. My theory is that groups tend
to
be self-moderating, and when someone is acting like a tool, an apology
tends to come out soon or the tool leaves in a huff when people call
him
on it. (I'd say him or her, but oddly, there are no women to my
knowledge
on this list.)
I have not read all the emails that have come through the list lately,
as
I'm moving a server room to two different locations and relocating an
office
of about 50 people in the middle of all this, and I'd seen a couple of
poorly-written words, and offense taken where there was possibly none
intended. I have not seen it become uglier, so I must have missed
something.
I will write to people off list as necessary, but a few notes to all
list members: Be civil, and remember that things written
sarcastically,
cynically or tongue-in-cheek can often be taken the wrong way.
- --
======================================================================
Joe Hartley - UNIX/network Consultant - jh@brainiac.com
Without deviation from the norm, "progress" is not possible. - FZappa
=====
Post to the entire list by writing to tft@brainiac.com.
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"unsubscribe tft"
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------------------------------
Date: Tue, 29 Apr 2008 07:33:33 -0700
From: "Christopher Brandon" <brandon@pokemon-seattle.com>
Subject: RE: (TFT) Is TFT a role playing or board game?
Thanks Ray! George did send me a link to your site, and I appreciate
your kind words. The site is great...looking forward to an update to
the site!
I certainly hope the next adventure of the 20th legion is even better!
If you have not tried one of their Sci-fi adventures yet, you really
should-DCG has yet to put out a clinker they are all great!
Cheers!
Chris
Pokimon USA
- -----Original Message-----
From: tft-admin@brainiac.com [mailto:tft-admin@brainiac.com] On Behalf
Of Ray Rangel
Sent: Monday, April 28, 2008 5:46 PM
To: tft@brainiac.com
Cc: George Dew
Subject: RE: (TFT) Is TFT a role playing or board game?
I'm certianly one of the ones looking for a sequel! Chris, see my
blog. I have pix of my first attempt a running through WotR.
- ---- George Dew <gdew@ResponseNetworking.com> wrote:
Just a quick statement about programmed adventures (PA). (BTW, Chris'
adventure, "Wolves on the Rhine," published by Dark City Games is
excellent).
Chris is right that PAs are limiting.
Unfortunately, there's not really much that we can do about it.
PAs offer individuals the ability to play adventures either by just
reading
through, or by playing solitaire. This is better than nothing at all.
For groups, programmed adventures offer people the opportunity to play
through adventures without having to do the massive amount of
background
work required to write an interesting campaign. Once you have this
baseline,
the GM can expound freely on what the adventurers can do, provided
the GM
has an understanding of the PA.
I guess it's just that there are always trade-offs in the way you do
things.
So although PAs are limiting, they are wonderful to have around.
BTW Chris, there's a lot of people asking for your sequel.
-----Original Message-----
From: tft-admin@brainiac.com [mailto:tft-admin@brainiac.com] On
Behalf Of
Christopher Brandon
Sent: Monday, April 28, 2008 11:31
To: tft@brainiac.com
Subject: RE: (TFT) Is TFT a role playing or board game?
Sorry Mr. Jackson, despite my earlier protestations to avoid posting,
the
thoughtful posts by Ray and others enticed me to return.
First, I have zero issues with TFT used as an RPG system however one
defines
that personally. I was fortunate enough to have an adventure
published by
DCG so clearly I think the base system is great and I do use it in my
own
playing (although in my very tweaked homebrewed rules set).
Part of my Tactical RPG versus Story telling RPG thoughts stem from
writing
adventures in the solitaire/ programmed format for Dark City.
(great guys & great adventures!) I find writing in this format
constricting
and to be honest limiting. Let me take a moment from a recent non
programmed adventure to illustrate:
You arrive in town with 6 silver pieces each, an empty stomach, and a
hunger
for adventure. Two characters are in a port town and need money to
get
passage to an island where an ancient tomb is said to be. They pool
their
cash, haggle, and buy a very small bag of fine tobacco. They then go
deeper
into town trying to sell it as part of a recently arrived select
cargo.
They go through town and find a buyer. They set up a meet with the
buyer at
their "warehouse." Their warehouse is actually one they track down,
break
into, KO the guards, then meet the merchant, make the sale, and then
try to
sneak out of town with the cash. The try to bribe the guards to let
them
out, then have to fight the guards to keep the coin. They end up
scattering
the cash to end the fight. Each ends up with 50 silver for all the
trouble,
two different angry merchant's after them, and the town guard looking
for
them while they are still trapped in the city.
That little interlude is about 5 hours worth of role playing with
reactions,
fast talking, hunting through tobacco shops, hunting to find a
warehouse
with tobacco in it, combat and all sorts of shenanigans. If I were
to try
and program that one night adventure out, it would easily be 40-50
pages
with all sorts of yes/no/maybe threads. Would it be fun for the
player?
Mine thought so, but would it be fun for the writer...for myself I
dread the
thought.
Why? 2 reasons: First because the programmed adventure relies on die
rolls
for success versus the player's ability to try and "sell" the GM what
they
are attempting and act it out. Second, because I have to write out
every
possible out come from every decision or failed die roll even though
maybe
half to 1/3 will actually be experienced in play.
There were only two combats in the entire adventure, and really only
one was
life threatening. So maybe my issue is really one of programmed
adventures.
The format is roll-playing heavy decision tree, and not really
role-playing
where how you "act" has much more influence then a binary
success/fail die
roll format.
Example:
You enter the dry goods shop. The smell of spices and incense swirl
in the
stained glass colored air. A large, muscled fellow off to the left
holding a
staff watches you suspiciously as you enter. Deep brightly colored
carpets
muffle the sound of your boots on the floor; though the occasional
squeak of
wood under the carpets tells of a shop that has stood for quite some
time.
The pinch faced, corpulent, black bearded fellow behind a tapestry
covered
counter smiles as he looks up. Then you see the corners of his smile
falter
and his eyes darken when he eyes your shabby dress. "Yes?" He asks
imperiously.
In a role playing adventure the characters can now throw out a whole
host of
different responses. Not so in a programmed adventure. Also would
this
sort of interaction be any fun in a programmed adventure?
Especially if written without any die rolls or interaction beyond "If
you
say...go to XX" over and over and over for 95% of the tale? I am
going to
guess...not so much. Yet at the table it was a hell of a lot of fun.
All of that (sorry so long) to say maybe the combat centric nature of
adventures published to support TFT may be what creates in my mind a
sense
of limits to the system as originally written. Thoughts?
Cheers!
Chris
-----Original Message-----
From: tft-admin@brainiac.com [mailto:tft-admin@brainiac.com] On
Behalf Of
Ray Rangel
Sent: Sunday, April 27, 2008 7:09 AM
To: tft@brainiac.com
Subject: (TFT) Is TFT a role playing or board game?
The recent conversation has got me musing over what a role playing
game
really is. But, before I begin, please understand that these are my
own
thoughts and mental meanderings and nothing more. With that said...
I've been playing, first strategic board games, then tabletop
historical
miniatures games, and in the last few years various RPGs, since I was
eighteen. That's about thirty-five years. The one universal element
that
I've found in all of those years of gaming is that everyone role
plays.
The
miniatures gamer oversees the deployment and movement of his vast
Napoleonic
army and soon take on the role of Marshall Ney, Davout, or Bonaparte
himself. Many is the miniature or paper battle that has been fought
on the
border of Natal and Zululand where the players have assumed the role
of the
stiff upper lipped Victorian officer or the proud brave Zulu prince
fighting
for their lives at Rourke's Drift.
Yet we generally don't consider these role playing games. Why not? I
think
that it is question of game design and intent rather than how is a
game is
actually used. The miniatures rules or board game focus is on the
mechanics
of play on the tabletop or board. The definitions and rules provided
apply
to movement, combat, and morale of the playing pieces (whether
cardboard
chits or miniature soldiers). Any role playing is left up to the
players and
their understanding of historical (or fictional) personalities. The
objective in the miniatures or board game is to win.
Of course there are role playing games (or roleplaying, as it has
become one
word in the industry and gaming community and RPG for short). These
games
are specifically designed to provide the players a framework on which
to
build a character or characters of which they assume the roles and act
accordingly. The objective of the RPG is to assume the guise of a
character
and to play.
Of course, these descriptions represent the poles. There are an
infinite
number of variation between them with many games borrowing elements
from the
other in varying degrees. In my opinion, TFT is pretty darn close to
the
equator. It, obviously, has strong elements of board gaming--it also
has
strong elements of role playing games. I suppose this is why it is so
easy
to have contention when talking about TFT. In any given situation or
rules
discussion, one must first determine whether the correspondents are
viewing
the topic from one pole, the other, pole or the same pole. This is
can be
very difficult, in my opinion, because TFT lies on the midpoint and,
thus
both points of view--while different--are valid.
Anyhow...I hope you all will excuse my ramblings on this quite Sunday
morning. My intent is not to convince anyone of anything; rather to
simply
talk about my personal outlook and thoughts on TFT as happy medium
between a
board game and a role playing game.
Ray Rangel
ray.rangel@cox.net
http://xraysvision.blogspot.com/
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- --
Diplomacy is the art of saying, "Nice doggy..." while reaching for a
rock.
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Date: Tue, 29 Apr 2008 09:41:14 -0500
From: David Jackson <azog@bellsouth.net>
Subject: Re: (TFT) Leaving List
Despite the fact that you are now insulting me directly, I wish to
say, let's let the matter drop.
Everybody presented themselves inappropriately, myself no less than
others, and the whole thing has now blown way out of proportion.
For any one I may have offended, I am sorry that you feel that way.
Now let's just drop it.
David Jackson
On Apr 29, 2008, at 9:30 AM, Christopher Brandon wrote:
Hello-
As a new poster I was quite off put by the first reaction to my
thoughts
on the game system. Clearly my heretical thoughts offended Mr.
Jackson
or at least the manner in which I stated them apparently did. For
that
I did apologize. I did not appreciate the antagonistic and rude
manner
in which he voiced his discontent, but clearly the manner in which I
made my post offended him. As a result of his less than polite
disagreement I had decided to simply stay quiet.
Then other responses turned up. I think the vast majority of folks
read
it for what I meant it to be: an inquiry into an alternate way of
creating adventures that mirrored similar video games-and whether
or not
that idea is interesting to current TFT'ers on the list. The vast
majority took time to discuss it, think about it, and share there own
insights, disagreements, and comments in a friendly and thoughtful
manner.
To my way of reading it Mr. Jackson has a tendency to take offense at
thoughts counter to his own and then in a very aggressive and
disparaging way respond. I do take offense to many of his statements,
but rather than respond in kind, I just let it go. It does not
serve me
or, the community to respond in kind to many statements that I
personally read as rude or unkind.
I made the mistake of deciding to let Mr. Jackson bully me off the
boards. I see there are others who now may be thinking the same
thing.
I would ask those thinking of this to please stay on as I did.
The majority of folks I have encountered on the board are thoughtful,
innovative, and passionate about this game. Should one fellow be
given
the power to drive us off? I think not. Removing someone I think is
the easy way out.
Mr. Jackson probably has some really interesting and great things to
say, unfortunately the language he chooses to use is very
unpleasant and
his message is lost to me because of it. I quit reading his posts
altogether for now and my problem was solved. If there is a someone
(me
for instance) whose posts or language you dislike, then just ignore
the
post. You do not have to read everything, and you should not let one
negative wipe out a lot of positive enjoyment you get from sharing
thoughts and innovations on these lists. Don't punish yourself for
someone else's bad behavior.
Cheers!
Chris
-----Original Message-----
From: tft-admin@brainiac.com [mailto:tft-admin@brainiac.com] On Behalf
Of Joe Hartley
Sent: Tuesday, April 29, 2008 5:32 AM
To: tft@zappa.brainiac.com
Subject: Re: (TFT) Leaving List
On Mon, 28 Apr 2008 21:39:53 -0400
"Jonathan & Laura" wrote:
If there is
going to be no moderation of uncivil behavior/personal attacks, I'm
going to
sign-off also.
"Wizard Master" wrote:
Just thought the moderator of this list should know the reason for my
depature.
Those of you who have been on this list a long time will know that my
approach to moderating is... laid-back. My theory is that groups tend
to
be self-moderating, and when someone is acting like a tool, an apology
tends to come out soon or the tool leaves in a huff when people
call him
on it. (I'd say him or her, but oddly, there are no women to my
knowledge
on this list.)
I have not read all the emails that have come through the list lately,
as
I'm moving a server room to two different locations and relocating an
office
of about 50 people in the middle of all this, and I'd seen a couple of
poorly-written words, and offense taken where there was possibly none
intended. I have not seen it become uglier, so I must have missed
something.
I will write to people off list as necessary, but a few notes to all
list members: Be civil, and remember that things written
sarcastically,
cynically or tongue-in-cheek can often be taken the wrong way.
--
======================================================================
Joe Hartley - UNIX/network Consultant - jh@brainiac.com
Without deviation from the norm, "progress" is not possible. - FZappa
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Date: Tue, 29 Apr 2008 07:30:24 -0700
From: "Christopher Brandon" <brandon@pokemon-seattle.com>
Subject: RE: (TFT) Leaving List
Hello-
As a new poster I was quite off put by the first reaction to my
thoughts
on the game system. Clearly my heretical thoughts offended Mr. Jackson
or at least the manner in which I stated them apparently did. For that
I did apologize. I did not appreciate the antagonistic and rude manner
in which he voiced his discontent, but clearly the manner in which I
made my post offended him. As a result of his less than polite
disagreement I had decided to simply stay quiet.
Then other responses turned up. I think the vast majority of folks
read
it for what I meant it to be: an inquiry into an alternate way of
creating adventures that mirrored similar video games-and whether or
not
that idea is interesting to current TFT'ers on the list. The vast
majority took time to discuss it, think about it, and share there own
insights, disagreements, and comments in a friendly and thoughtful
manner.
To my way of reading it Mr. Jackson has a tendency to take offense at
thoughts counter to his own and then in a very aggressive and
disparaging way respond. I do take offense to many of his statements,
but rather than respond in kind, I just let it go. It does not serve
me
or, the community to respond in kind to many statements that I
personally read as rude or unkind.
I made the mistake of deciding to let Mr. Jackson bully me off the
boards. I see there are others who now may be thinking the same thing.
I would ask those thinking of this to please stay on as I did.
The majority of folks I have encountered on the board are thoughtful,
innovative, and passionate about this game. Should one fellow be given
the power to drive us off? I think not. Removing someone I think is
the easy way out.
Mr. Jackson probably has some really interesting and great things to
say, unfortunately the language he chooses to use is very unpleasant
and
his message is lost to me because of it. I quit reading his posts
altogether for now and my problem was solved. If there is a someone (me
for instance) whose posts or language you dislike, then just ignore the
post. You do not have to read everything, and you should not let one
negative wipe out a lot of positive enjoyment you get from sharing
thoughts and innovations on these lists. Don't punish yourself for
someone else's bad behavior.
Cheers!
Chris
- -----Original Message-----
From: tft-admin@brainiac.com [mailto:tft-admin@brainiac.com] On Behalf
Of Joe Hartley
Sent: Tuesday, April 29, 2008 5:32 AM
To: tft@zappa.brainiac.com
Subject: Re: (TFT) Leaving List
On Mon, 28 Apr 2008 21:39:53 -0400
"Jonathan & Laura" wrote:
If there is
going to be no moderation of uncivil behavior/personal attacks, I'm
going to
sign-off also.
"Wizard Master" wrote:
Just thought the moderator of this list should know the reason for my
depature.
Those of you who have been on this list a long time will know that my
approach to moderating is... laid-back. My theory is that groups tend
to
be self-moderating, and when someone is acting like a tool, an apology
tends to come out soon or the tool leaves in a huff when people call
him
on it. (I'd say him or her, but oddly, there are no women to my
knowledge
on this list.)
I have not read all the emails that have come through the list lately,
as
I'm moving a server room to two different locations and relocating an
office
of about 50 people in the middle of all this, and I'd seen a couple of
poorly-written words, and offense taken where there was possibly none
intended. I have not seen it become uglier, so I must have missed
something.
I will write to people off list as necessary, but a few notes to all
list members: Be civil, and remember that things written
sarcastically,
cynically or tongue-in-cheek can often be taken the wrong way.
- --
======================================================================
Joe Hartley - UNIX/network Consultant - jh@brainiac.com
Without deviation from the norm, "progress" is not possible. - FZappa
=====
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------------------------------
Date: Tue, 29 Apr 2008 09:42:46 -0700 (PDT)
From: Steve Reinhardt <stever08y@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: (TFT) Is TFT a role playing or board game?
Why are we afraid to call Wizard and Melee wargames?
Because they are...wargames.
What? Surely this isn't in response to a post in which these were
referred to as boardgames. I would be interested in hearing from
anyone who disagrees with this assertion.
- ---------------------------------
Be a better friend, newshound, and know-it-all with Yahoo! Mobile.
Try it now.
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Date: Tue, 29 Apr 2008 12:30:57 -0500
From: David Jackson <azog@bellsouth.net>
Subject: (TFT) Map and Counters by David Jackson
Quite some time ago, I had done some high resolution maps and
counters for TFT, which I hope that some of you find useful (they
were actually created for Wizard / Melee).
Since there are some new people to the list, here are the links.
Since these links may expire at any time (but haven't for a year or
so now), get them while they are available.
Please note that these are high resolution, and by all reckoning
should be printed at the default sizes set in the PDF. Also note
that these are not legal for distribution (which is why I am sharing
them here).
http://home.paws.lsu.edu/djacks8/wizard_counters_1.pdf
http://home.paws.lsu.edu/djacks8/wizard_counters_2.pdf
http://home.paws.lsu.edu/djacks8/wizard_counters_3.pdf
This is the final map (and the one that I use in my own gaming)...
http://home.paws.lsu.edu/djacks8/Wizard_Map1_Complete.pdf
This is an earlier map...maybe useful to some...
http://home.paws.lsu.edu/djacks8/wizard_map_pre.pdf
I hope that somebody finds a use for these...
David Jackson
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Date: Tue, 29 Apr 2008 13:58:53 -0700 (PDT)
From: pvk@oz.net
Subject: Re: (TFT) Map and Counters by David Jackson
Those are very nice - thanks for sharing!
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------------------------------
Date: Tue, 29 Apr 2008 21:31:55 -0400
From: Ray Rangel <ray.rangel@cox.net>
Subject: Re: (TFT) Re: TFT Digest V3 #1005
This is, indeed, correct. The apparent energy decreases with the
square of the distance when the energy is evenly distributed and
incoherant (e.g. starlight). However, this is not true when the energy
is directed in a single direction or is coherant (e.g. LASER light).
Thus the energy resulting from an asteriod which gets blown up by a
charge set at its center would disipate pretty evenly and would rarify
(on average) by the square of the distance from the center.
As a side note: the amount of energy from the explosion never really
decreases. It simply becomes dispursed over a wider area. Thus less of
the energy acts on an object which is further away.
- ---- Mark Tapley <mtapley@swri.edu> wrote:
At 20:46 -0400 4/28/08, TFT Digest wrote:
An explosion expands in a sphere so I would expect
it to decrease ~1/r^3.
The volume of a sphere does indeed go as 1/r^3, but the surface area,
along which the shock wave acts, goes as 1/r^2. I had thought the
latter was a better approximation, but I'm not sure about that. If
PvK is doing actual research, he'll be much better qualified to
answer than me.
--
- Mark, 210-379-4635
----------------------------------------------------------------------
-
Large Asteroids headed toward planets
inhabited by beings that don't have
technology adequate to stop them:
Think of it as Evolution in Fast-Forward.
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rock.
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------------------------------
End of TFT Digest V3 #1006
**************************
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