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RE: (TFT) Standing up... movement or action?

Interesting.  You brought up a point I didn't think of before about the pole
weapons.  Let me see if I got this right though.  Are you saying that you
can't force retreat a prone or knocked down figure?  I don't remember reading
that in the rulebook.  If that's right then, there is a lot more strategy in
forcing retreat than I thought.  In your example, if I was knocked down and
chose not to stand up during the action phase, the spearman would not get to
force his retreat.  Then if I could stand up during the movement phase (and if
I got initiative) I could stand up and engage him again, so he wouldn't be
able to do a charge attack again.  Is that what you were talking about?

> Date: Sun, 12 Oct 2008 19:14:54 -0700
> From: rick.walters@yahoo.com
> Subject: Re: (TFT) Standing up... movement or action?
> To: tft@brainiac.com
> Well, this is a sticky wicket. The rules are pretty straight forward.  On
page 18 of advanced Mele it says "A figure takes 8 or more hits in one turn
immediately falls down.  If it has not already attacked, it may not attack
that turn.  It may do nothing NEXT turn except stand up (or stay down)."
> That said, I've never met a GM that didn't eventually change this rule and
allow standing as both a movement and an action.  The alternate rule allows
that you can stand during movement (as a move) or you can stand during attack
(as an action).  So, If you hit someone and do enough damage to knock them
down, and they have not attacked yet, then they may choose to stand and ready
as their action.
> Why is this adopted?  Well, the likely reason is because it makes sense. It
doesn't make much sense that a person can be knocked down and execute the
action of taking someone HTH, but that they can't simply stand up.
> It is also terribly unfair.  If you're a low dex character, you'll quickly
know how unfair it is.  Against a fighter with a higher dex and a greatsword,
you can get knocked down and NEVER get a chance to get up again.  You just get
knocked down again and again until you're dead.  The fighter will have two
rounds to hit you and knock you back down once you've been badly hurt.  It
just makes players super angry.
> There is also another interesting craziness that comes with not being able
to stand as an action..  Let's say that I don't have a pole weapon, but I want
to slide into an adjacent hex against a person setting on me.  Provided they
don't kill you when they hit you, they will almost certainly knock you down if
they hit (double damage on a set).  So, you're hit and you fall down.  Now,
because you don't stand up during attack, the defender loses the ability to
"force retreat" in the next round (which occurs at the end of action).  So,
you've just robbed the defender of the ability to set on you twice.
Personally, I see "force retreat" as one of the most important aspects of
Mele.  "Force Retreat" makes battle lines "fluid" and without it, often there
doesn't even need to be a movement round.  So, I don't like aspects of the
game that remove this as an option.
> Lastly, I think that GM's get really frustrated by the "stand next round"
rule.  The main problem is balancing a battle.  This is especially true when
characters get up and above 40 points.  What happens is that the characters
almost always hit and nearly always knock down their opponents with their high
DX and bad-ass weapons.  So, in order to try to balance the fight, the GM is
left no option but to put the party up against enemies with equal or higher
dex and equally large weapons to give them a chance of hurting the party at
all.  Unfortuantely, what happens is that one side or the other gets the early
luck and the  other side dies.  So the rule is hard to work around.
> Anyway, I hope this helps.  You can be a purist and stick to the rule, or
you can allow standing and readying as an action.  Either way, just stay
consistent and let people know your house rule before a game if you change any
rule in the book.
> Good Fortune,
> Richard
> ----- Original Message ----
> From: Jim Zmrazek <jzmra@hotmail.com>
> To: tft@brainiac.com
> Sent: Sunday, October 12, 2008 7:02:51 PM
> Subject: (TFT) Standing up... movement or action?
> This has been bothering me for awhile, so I'll just ask it now.  When
> the turn does a figure stand up if they were knocked down in combat?  I'll
> an example.  There are elves and orcs fighting.  The elves have higher DX,
> all of them go first before any of the orcs.  A few elves attack an orc and
> deal 8 hits to him.  He falls down.  The other elves that have not taken
> actions may attack the orc on the ground (if they were adjacent) and get
> +4 bonus to hit him.  When the knocked down orc's turn comes, will he be
> to stand up?
> The next question I was wondering is when you actually stand up during your
> turn.  Do you do it during your movement phase?  I believe it mentions
> something about kneeling or prone figures just standing still and changing
> their stances.  Or do you have to wait until the action phase in the order
> DX?
> I've been playing if that if you get knocked down, you lose your action for
> the turn if you didn't take it.  You must wait until your action next turn
> stand up.  Is that correct?
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