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Re: (TFT) Spear vs. Shortsword maneuvers
Bigger impact running and driving a spear, but to give you something ever
yone has had some experience with. Take a log or piece of wood then hit
it with an axe (the biggest you have). That concussive force is greater t
han a spear thrust. I fully admit that it is spread over a broader surfa
ce, and it is not impaling damage but it gives you a idea getting hit wit
h a spear hurts even with padding we used (and blunted weapons).
Getting past the point usually takes time to set up (at least a second o
r two) to feint and then move in if you screw it up its like rolling a 6
in HTH (autohit) as you just jumped on the point. But if he is not thrus
ting right at that second you can recover.
Neil is right once you get past the point you can still use the shaft to
either defend or attack (think bad fighting in Phantom Menace). Also th
e butt can be used (now think Quarter staff), that being said the advanta
ge is with the shorter weapon now. I can say all this but it really depe
nds upon the relative skill of the two people and what dirty tricks they
know. In general, running at anyone out of control is an easy way to com
mit suicide.
Edward Kroeten
Farmers Agent
7100 Stevenson Blvd Suite 105
Fremont, CA 94538
Office Phone 510-646-1500
Mobile Phone 510-579-0135
Fax 510-438-6875
Website: www.kroeteninsurance.com
------ Original Message ------
Received: 10:36 AM PDT, 10/21/2015
From: PvK <pvk@oz.net>
To: <tft@brainiac.com>
Subject: Re: (TFT) Spear vs. Shortsword maneuvers
I'd be very interested to hear what Neil and Edward and those with s
ome actual experience/training have to say about how they would design ru
les for polearms (and/or other long weapons) against shorter hand weapons
, in a way that could capture the nature of the situation in real-world p
ractice.
In particular, the part about getting past the longer-reach weapon
to be able to use the shorter weapon against the long-weapon user.
It seems to me that there is clearly an advantage for a longer wea
pon when outside the shorter weapon's reach (can't hit). Also it seems th
at the longer weapon has some options to try to deny the opponent approac
h, or injure him on the way in.
I can see that a two-handed spear would have better leverage for i
mpaling than a sword (unless perhaps you put one hand a ways up on the bl
ade to use it like a spear) even close up. It seems intuitive to me thoug
h that it there would be even more force/leverage against someone who sta
rts outside your reach, because you can put both your center mass and the
ir center mass on opposite ends of the pole, no?
I'm also curious if people who've actually practised stabbing thin
gs with polearms (or staves) feel there's an impact advantage for running
in while doing it, or how that would affect the situation?
PvK
--- Edward ekroeten@farmersagent.com wrote:
15 years of fencing 10 years of martial arts I pretty sure I und
erstand putting force behind a specific point to cause damage.
Also even against a quarterstaff if you get close the sword has th
e advantage.
...
--- Neil raito@raito.com wrote:
If you haven't actually been in armour against a spear, I'd encour
age you
to not make statements that you have no first-hand experience of.
I've
been on both sides of that equation. The only reason I'm not more
effective with the spear is that the rules I'm generally constrain
ed by
don't allow me many useful maneuvers, like using the butt end of t
he
spear, or deliberately putting someone on the ground. Frequently I
end up
engaged by someone with your attitude that once you're past the po
inty
end, the spearman is toast. They get dissuaded quickly.
Also, the idea that a sword lunge and spear lunge are just as powe
rful
shows a woeful lack of knowledge. Again, unless you've done it, do
n't make
the statement. Even two handed sword thrusts aren't as powerful as
a spear
thrust. Single handed weapons are only as strong as the single wri
st on
the weapon. 2 handed swords are generally limited by hilt length (
unless
you are half-swording, in which case the argument is moot). With t
he
spear, the 2 more widely spaced hands brace the weapon against gla
ncing,
flexing, and having to rely on the strength of the single wrist. I
can
assure you from direct experience that sword thrusts are not much
compared
to a spear thrust.
Neil Gilmore
raito@raito.com
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