RE: (TFT) Intentions - as I understand them, at least

["Jay Carlisle" <selfinflicted_wounds@boardermail.com>]

> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "John J Hyland" <johnnyboytmm@juno.com>

What is the definition of  TFT Strength?

TFT ITL
5. Strength	pg.8

STRENGTH (ST) governs:
(1) how many hits a fighter can take.
(2) how many spells a wizard can cast. (also size of effect)
(3) how much weight a figure can carry - see EQUIPMENT.
(4) how resistant to poisons the figure is. 
(5) how easily it can resist being knocked down, grabbed, or otherwise physically mistreated.
(6) how heavy a weapon it may use in combat.

And this is as close as we get to a definition of St in TFT.

It seems to me that the basic idea behind St is a relative measure of force.
The basic idea behind Dx seems to be precision.
IQ keeps looking like a catch all. (if it don't move it's probably IQ)


>>"For me the description of a portal may be "requires St17 to lift unaided or 30 pts dam to break down."

>>"And that is enough detail/abstraction for game play, and if the party possesses a "sturdy rope" and attaches it to the door, so that 2 ST16 hero's can lift together, the GM makes a judgment call as to whether it is enough to work."

This is fair enough as far as it goes, but I'd like to point out a couple of things in the above quote.
First, isn't 30 pts dam 30 St, i.e. 1 hit = 1 pt dam = 1 St?
Second, who says I have to go "through" the portal?
I start digging, for example.
These things are interactive...
What happens when the players try something "odd"?

>>"Also knowing the value of 1 HP (technically also 1ST, but in a different fashion)"

???
What fashion?


>>"If I get Jay, I think he is looking to be able to say "the portal is 5 inches thick, made of local hardwoods, reinforced with pig-iron lags and rivets"  So knowing that local to this area he'd know that the most abundant local hard wood is oak. < snip >  At the end of the day we have the same door, just different ways of getting there. :-)"

Perhaps I can elaborate on my method, that you have described so well.
The idea isn't so much to have a "scientific" view of doors (for example), but to be able to use reference material as an arbiter in cases where a player decides to focus on a particular door in an unconventional manner.

There is also the issue of large scale spell effects, but that's a whole other can of worms. 
Basically, I'm making buildings that can be blow up. 

8' x 4' x 5" of Oak implies Lumberjacks.
Iron bits imply Miners and Smiths, or at least traders.
Oak + Iron = Door, implies carpenters.
We've already got Job Tables...

When the door is keeping something else out instead of the players themselves, views tend to change.

Also of particular note here is the idea that the local area is "known".
100 families who burn wood for heat/cooking/manufacturing etc., much less build with it, are going to clear out some woods over time. More on this in 'Rough and Ready Campaigns'.  



>>"So any GM and any group of players will get the exact same result."

BINGO!
As much as possible...
Easier said that done, however isn't this a major part of what makes TFT, TFT and not D&D?

But;
>>"I am unlikely to adopt a game like his, because my comfort
zone involves a lot more abstraction than I think he's going for."
  
>>"As long time readers of the list may recall, I tend to land on the playability side of the realism vs playability scale.  So any new mechanic has to add a lot of fun to the game for me to want to adopt it."

I can understand this completely!

I suppose I worry about concepts like plot and story, as they apply to an interactive game.
Don't players have free will?
You can bait the hook, but if the players don't take the bait? 
Is the GM's story more important than the player?
Don't show players anything that your not willing to let them mess with.
If your going to make them go through Tolkinairs Lair, don't show the players the map of Elayntia or even start them in Bendwyn.
Start them at the Lair.
Anything else gives the illusion of choice that's not really there.
Show me a map and I'm gonna end up trying to find what's outside the map.
I don't think there is no place for story or plot.
I just think that players can make stories through play.
Plot is what the antagonists do.

Anyway, just some thoughts.


Jay  


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