Re: (TFT) Howard Thompson versus Steve Jackson (and Pole Weapons)

["gem6868" <gem6868@verizon.net>]

The problem with any large, heavy, long weapon is that you get most of your 
"massive damage" from the big swing and ensuing momentum.  The problem is 
that when you take the big swing, you are wide open and you'll get skewered 
by the fast guy thrusting with the rapier.  Physically (as in Newtonian 
Physics...would that be "physicsly?) it's like a guy with a baseball bat 
fighting a guy with a knife.  Sure the guy with the bat can try for the big 
swing that will probably severely damage or kill the other guy, but he's 
vulnerable during the windup.  If you choose not to use your big pole arm / 
battle axe / pike / doppleganger like this, you're using a big spear, and 
are back to limited damage but you should have some advantage from the 
length - perhaps a ST bonus if you're strong, or the double damage from 
momentum (yours or his).

Seems to me that the most logical thing to do is fight in order of DX giving 
the pole arm the choice of being a big axe or a spear.  If it's a spear, you 
get less damage (d6+2) probably but you've the chance to acquire a bonus to 
your impaling with pole arm bonus from Melee or the Strength bonus in Adv 
Melee / GURPS (can't remember which).  If you choose to use the weapon as a 
heavy axe with a big windup, you should be SLOWER but get a lot more damage 
if you hit.

Warhammer (God help us) uses something like this - longer weapons do strike 
first but they're usually pretty weak, while the 2-handed weapons strike 
last with more damage.  I think that at least respects the physics of the 
weapons.  NOTE: I can't believe I'm using an example from Warhammer, but it 
just popped into my head.

-----Original Message----- 
From: Lloyd Weber
Sent: Tuesday, October 11, 2011 8:28 PM
To: tft@brainiac.com
Subject: Re: (TFT) Howard Thompson versus Steve Jackson (and Pole Weapons)

What about giving the pole weapon user an option to either 1) automatically 
strike first, but at say -2 or -3 dx, or 2) striking in regular adj. dx 
sequence? This would simulate the difficulty of accurately aiming a strike 
at first contact.

On Oct 11, 2011, at 12:39 PM, "gem6868" <gem6868@verizon.net> wrote:

Physically the critical moment for any weapon, but especially a longer one, 
is the parry.  If someone parries your spear / pole axe / pike whatever then 
once they are inside your guard you are dead meat unless you've a dagger or 
are willing to try hand to hand (or running).  The idea that a polearm 
always strikes first is unrealistic and unbelievable.  First strike isn't 
about length, it's about speed and agility.  If you're slow, it doesn't 
matter what you're armed with.  Do you believe that a DX8 character in plate 
should automatically swing before a DX 15 character with a rapier?  I just 
can't.  That snail should be an easy target.

I like the +1d6 idea better than doubling, also.

-----Original Message----- From: PvK
Sent: Tuesday, October 11, 2011 2:11 PM
To: tft@brainiac.com
Subject: Re: (TFT) Howard Thompson versus Steve Jackson (and Pole Weapons)

I like the +1 die versus doubling suggestion too, which I think is also an 
ancient house rule (did it even make it into Interplay? I think maybe it 
did).

I don't like removing the first-strike, because I think it makes so much 
physical sense, though I think the charge situation wouldn't always apply, 
hence the suggestion I made.

--- hulkasgt@yahoo.com wrote:
...

In my own opinion, the only real change you need to make to Pole Weapons in 
Advanced Melee is to eliminate the rule that they always act first when 
involved in a charge. Per my experience, that brings everything back in 
balance, and brings Dex back to its important place in character builds.

That said, I do like David O. Miller's house rule about adding a set number 
of dice to a charge instead of doubling the dice. It gives those guys in 
plate mail at least a fighting chance to survive.

--- On Sat, 10/8/11, PvK <pvk@oz.net> wrote:

From: PvK <pvk@oz.net>
Subject: Re: (TFT) Howard Thompson versus Steve Jackson (and Pole Weapons)
PvK: What would people think of this for an alternate pole
weapon nerf? (I'm just making this up over my morning
coffee, but give it a think.)
   1) A pole weapon user who begins
the turn engaged may no charge bonuses against others moving
up to engage that turn.
   2) To get charge bonuses, either
the pole weapon user, or his target, must have moved more
than one hex this turn.
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