Re: (TFT) Twisting the Knight Away

[Christopher Fuhrman <fuhrman8or@yahoo.com>]

--- Peter von Kleinsmid <pvk@oz.net> wrote:
> At 01:47 PM 12/3/06 +0000, John wrote:
> >But that all only applies to melee, not HTH, since a run around HTH
> >attack never came up in my years of gaming.  As I said, I would presume
> >that an attacker who could do a run around to get a rear HTH attack
> >could also just initiate HTH by virtue of a higher MA.
> 
> No, a figure with higher MA will still be stopped by Front hexes and be 
> forced to attempt HTH as an action in DX order, giving the opponents some 
> chance to disengage or cut him down before he can tackle them.

[snip]

> One example of the problem is like this:
>  __    __    __    __    __    __
> /  \__/  \__/  \__/  \__/  \__/  \__
> \__/  \__/vK\__/  \__/  \__/  \__/
> /  \__/  \__/  \__/  \__/  \__/  \__
> \__/  \__/ 1\__/  \__/  \__/  \__/
> /  \__/  \__/  \__/  \__/  \__/  \__
> \__/^X\__/ 2\__/  \__/  \__/  \__/
> /  \__/ 3\__/  \__/  \__/  \__/  \__
> \__/ 4\__/  \__/  \__/  \__/  \__/
> /  \__/  \__/  \__/  \__/  \__/  \__
> \__/  \__/  \__/  \__/  \__/  \__/
> 
> Xygor is an Elvish swordsman at X facing north, with DX 18, MA 14, 
> Alertness, and Unarmed Combat III.
> Kog is a hobgoblin with a dagger facing south, with DX 8, MA 10.
> 
> Roll for initiative - Kog wins 50% of the time.
> In the case where Kog wins initiative, he chooses to move first via the 
> hexes marked 1, 2, 3, 4, and then enters Xygor's hex via the rear, 
> initiating HTH instantly, and receiving everyone's generic 4/6 + re-roll 6 
> chance to succeed, knocking Xygor down, etc. None of Xygor's abilities nor 
> Kog's incompetences are taken into account.

I like your example. But, since if I accept the HTH initiation rule on
movement, I could say that Xygor was beaten tactically at the end of the round
prior to Kog winning initiative. Kog may not have a dagger. Xygor may have a
main-gauche ready, etc. All these conditions come into consideration before you
put your character in a tactical position. In ITL, there are the Tactics and
Strategy skills that affect initiative rolls, so that sways things as well.

[snip of another valid example with polearm]

> * That is, winning initiative in situations besides HTH initiation, means a 
> choice of whether to move first, but not whether to move and mess up 
> enemies before they can do anything at all. 

HTH is definitely a different beast, just as castling is in the game of chess.
I played chess for years as a kid before I learned of the castling rule, and my
game play changed afterwards. I'm not sure I ever really liked that rule,
because I grew to enjoy chess without it. But it's part of the canon.

> * So why should any old figure get to use HTH as a way to shortcut the 
> whole initiative system?

I don't see it as a shortcut, but merely another tactical situation to
consider. Ending movement on a turn such that a run-around is possible the next
turn is part of the tactics of the game. I recall spending much time as a party
in positioning our players, thinking ahead to possible enemy counter-moves,
facing, etc. One of the NPCs in our party used Avert a lot, and so we'd always
have to consider where the Avert spell would end up sending one of the enemy
hoard. 

I think it's legitimate to disallow HTH initiation through movement this way
because it may be seen as a loophole. But it can also be a special case that
you have to protect against. 


 
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